Them and us

[spikeychris]

Just seen this and I cant reply to the thread as its been locked the below is a copy of a post from Moon.....

"On most of the overseas sites that I visit the convention among Moderators is to extend the membership the courtesy of signing edits or deletions with the addition of a brief description of their reasoning. Looking at the WF rules I note that there is an opt-out from such courtesy and I suggest that this rule is changed for reasons of greater integration between moderators and members leading to a generally friendlier atmosphere born of equality and the removal of doubt."

The thread was locked with the following line......

"OK then, I'll close it.

It was started with the intent of causing disruption. It has achieved its aim so that's where it can end."

Its not my problem and its not my thread that has been locked but the locking post from a mod is amazing! This only generates a them and us situation and is well out of order.

[-pops-]

I have no real wish to continue this but, as you seem to want more sacrifices, the thread was locked at the request of another member as it was straying away from it original premise. If you read the thread, you will see that I was the first to make a response which states what I do when editing/modifying/removing threads - this hasn't changed and, quite frankly, I don't see how this could cause so much upset.

The only threads I have deleted in this forum have been out of date updates to various security programs.

If you feel that I should be a lamb to the slaughter, say so.

[spikeychris]

Pops I am not asking you to justify your mod status, nor am I asking for explanations as to why you have locked previous threads. You are a mod and its your job, as has been said elswhere you cant please 'em all. however your language concerns me

as you seem to want more sacrifices

what makes you think I want 'any' sacrifices!

If you feel that I should be a lamb to the slaughter, say so.

I dont want any lambs slaughtering I was just pointing out that to lock a thread with such a closing comment was out of order.

[Scarecrow Man]

If you PM me chris, I would have added your comment.

[nellie2]

I was just pointing out that to lock a thread with such a closing comment was out of order.

I think we have all done things that in retrospect weren't such a good idea! I know I have. So we learn from our mistakes.

[djohn]

It was me that posted to suggest it may be a good idea to close the thread. I thought at the time it was best for the forum but it only made things worse. :(

A new thread was opened much more vitriolic and led to the thread being not only locked but removed. Although I don't think I stepped out of line in the forum in anything I said, I do feel a great deal of responsibility for what happened after my request.

If I had not suggested the closing of the thread, the third one would not have been posted, it is this third "removed" thread that has caused much upset in the forum. In my opinion it was not northy's remarks that caused the problem to escalate. northy was in contact with me by PM at the time but now he feels that I have let him down and that I have made a personal attack on him. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Although I have not always agreed with the manner in which he sometimes address other people, I have never questioned his decision in public in the forum, that is until the first thread in a series of three or four that have caused so much unrest.

At least two threads connected with this issue have been removed or heavily edited for obvious reasons. I have no problem with this on a personal level but unless any member of the forum has managed to read both these threads in full, it would be unfair to make comment on what is still left for all to see. Removal or editing of threads is sometimes not only required but essential to the well being of the forum. We have to remember that many guest were logged on over the past two nights and had access to the debates and off the topic section.

It would have been a different matter if this issue could have been moved and confined to an area only available to members. Maybe it could have all been sorted out with a reasoned exchange of views between the members of this forum.

I don't know what else to say at this time, I have a lot of reading of PM's, e-mail that was sent to me last night, three or four of them not too pleasant. :(

[Scarecrow Man]

Perhaps we could have let everyone have thier say. Just let everyone go nuts for 1 night.

Clean it up the next day... I choose Powerless :P

[spikeychris]

Djohn, as Mr Newton pointed out every action has an equal and opposite reaction, you are not to blame for anything. My thread was not a witch hunt or a dragging up of old feelings it was just a response to a thread that was locked in a manner I thought wrong. Scarecrow man I didn't realise I could have PM'd you with a comment, as for Powerless cleaning up after a free for all - He'd have to write up a guide first..... B)

[cd108]

This has been almost non stop in the forum for 3 days now isnt it time we live and let live and moved on, if someone comes up with a genuine issue in the future deal with it there and then. Untill that time let sleeping dogs lie?

[artist]

This has been almost non stop in the forum for 3 days now isnt it time we live and let live and moved on,  if someone comes up with a genuine issue in the future deal with it there and then.  Untill that time let sleeping dogs lie?

Agreed - but don't let the resentments build............. :rolleyes:

[spikeychris]

Fair enough, I only saw it today.

[djohn]

Hi Spikey, I was going to mail you off forum but decided to say it here instead. Again the written word does not always come across as intended unless we have a good command of the English language. Sadly I don't have this and often leave out a word or two that on their own mean nothing but when omitted from a letter or post to a thread can have a significant affect.

I wasn't intending to suggest in any way that you should not comment on what has happened. It was a request to all members of the forum to take into account that there are omissions from the threads still on view and at least one, maybe two threads that have been removed. moons thread and Hurdys for instance. I can't find them.

Unless anyone has read both of those threads and observed the way in which they were moderated, it is difficult to make a comment on the remaining threads/post without possibly drawing the wrong conclusion.

It is obvious to all that there is unrest in the forum, has been for a couple of months now. Mistakes have been made, moderation has been made with remarks that were not necessary. If the threads had been left open to give the poster time to respond then other threads of more serious nature would not have been made. Theres nothing more annoying than to see an adverse comment made against you in public then not given the right to reply, of course it makes the person concerned even more aggravated and determined to start another thread in an attempt to get their point across.

Moderators have a difficult job to do, their decision and power to lock a thread is in the rules/guidelines that we all should read on joining. Many forums and I thought this one as well stood by these rules, one of them being not to enter into any argument or response in the forum as to why a decision had been made. Any disagreement to be dealt with off forum by PM or e-mail.

Threads have been started,members have posted. Often some of these have transgressed the guidelines of the forum and quite correctly they have been locked, edited or removed. These recent events have deteriorated by the actions of being closed with uncalled for comments from the person removing them. It matters not at the moment if it was the comments made by northy or pops that caused the problem but for the persons concerned to realise that their actions have escalated the problem unnecessarily so. :( dj.