The Election Fiasco

[Gandalph]

Alex Salmonds' SNP Party had a big shock at the elections. He is now down to six seats. Non of the Scots like him and he is just full of himself.

In the last picture of him that I saw he was so full of something that he looked as though he would soon burst. Was the filling "him", or "bovine excrement", or both?

Both I think catgate. He just opens his gob and anything comes out. :lol:

[AlanHo]

I think that it is prudent that we all swot up on what proportional representation is all about - especially the method favoured by the Lib-Dems

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It seems to me that it is no longer worth voting - it will not make any difference. If there was a chance of it making a difference New Labour would have made it illegal long ago.....

(I can remember many years ago that Harold Wison's government made homosexuality legal - I recall breathing a huge sigh of relief - because I feared they were about to make it compulsory)

[catgate]

I think the whole business, as per the lin, is unworkable

The only people who could work all that lot out would be us old foggies who learned old fashioned maths. No one educated during the last 30 years could follow it.....with or without a computer.

[rong]

Don't see why it should be a problem, If you vote for a party all the votes are added up and if you vote for an independent all the votes are added up and then you divide the number of votes cast by the number of seats to fill and work out who gets what from that. In the case of the independents the one with the highest votes get the seats but that's to easy I suppose

[catgate]

Don't see why it should be a problem, If you vote for a party all the votes are added up and if you vote for an independent all the votes are added up and then you divide the number of votes cast by the number of seats to fill and work out who gets what from that. In the case of the independents the one with the highest votes get the seats but that's to easy I suppose

No where near as easy.

You see, you need to take away the number you first thought of, and then someone else thinks of a number, more suitable to give the right answer, and then adds that.

[Gandalph]

Well there is one good thing come out of this fiasco. Gordon Brown resigning as PM. :D

Trouble is, which idiot are we going to get next.

[CurlyWhirly]

Don't see why it should be a problem, If you vote for a party all the votes are added up and if you vote for an independent all the votes are added up and then you divide the number of votes cast by the number of seats to fill and work out who gets what from that. In the case of the independents the one with the highest votes get the seats but that's to easy I suppose

The only thing is that any future government is composed of coalitions

Personally, I prefer the alternative voting system where the voter can rank parties i.e. 1st, 2nd and 3rd rather than just having the one vote like we have now.

I think we do need a different voting system because most of the 650 seats are safe Tory or Labour seats and therefore if you want to vote for another party, your vote is essentially wasted :(

[CurlyWhirly]

Well there is one good thing come out of this fiasco. Gordon Brown resigning as PM. :D

Trouble is, which idiot are we going to get next.

At least he will be an elected idiot :D

The money markets don't like the idea of a Lib-Lab pact and sterling has fallen sharply :0

[rong]

Don't see why it should be a problem, If you vote for a party all the votes are added up and if you vote for an independent all the votes are added up and then you divide the number of votes cast by the number of seats to fill and work out who gets what from that. In the case of the independents the one with the highest votes get the seats but that's to easy I suppose

The only thing is that any future government is composed of coalitions

Lot's of countries manage and it must be better than the dictatorships we get at the moment, the only thing that has saved us in the past is the house of lords that talk more sense than any of the elected rubbish we have at the moment

[CurlyWhirly]

the only thing that has saved us in the past is the house of lords that talk more sense than any of the elected rubbish we have at the moment

The House of Lords are unelected.

[CurlyWhirly]

p.s. talking of the House of Lords, look at Lord Mandelson who struts around after having resigned from the government numerous times for improper behaviour and Lord Adonis is in government and has not been voted in.

What's democratic about that?

[catgate]

I can see no logical reason to wish to be governed by "gangs".

What is going on at present is "godfathers" discussing how to co-operate, to each others mutual benefit, in the control of their "victims", and their "backers".

And how one "deposed" gangleader can openly try to "do a Mugabe" and expect to still be respected is totally beyond me. He really does need putting away somewhere. Has he not realised that clinging on by his fingernails is just not possible in his case?

[CurlyWhirly]

I can see no logical reason to wish to be governed by "gangs".

Agreed although I don't think that governments having massive majorities are good for democracy either as they can force almost any legislation through Parliament without proper scrutiny.

I'm refering to Thatcher's massive majority in 1979 and Blair's massive majority in 1997.

I think that a party only having a small majority is best for legislative purposes.

Has he not realised that clinging on by his fingernails is just not possible in his case?

I think that he is hoping to cling on to power by forming a pact with the Lib Dems and running a minority government.

[AlanHo]

The Lib Dems would do well to remember that the labour Party have a recent history of promising a referendum - only renege on the promise.

I saw John Reid on TV tonight - he sees a possible Lib Lab coalition as a disaster for the country and for both parties because it would be unstable. They would rely on the support of the Scots, Welsh and N.Irish MPs who all have their own agendas. The electorate would regard it as a stitch-up deal to cling on to power by both the big losers and voters would wreak their revenge at the next election which would be quite soon and would result in a Tory landslide.

[CurlyWhirly]

The Lib Dems would do well to remember that the labour Party have a recent history of promising a referendum - only renege on the promise.

I saw John Reid on TV tonight - he sees a possible Lib Lab coalition as a disaster for the country and for both parties because it would be unstable. They would rely on the support of the Scots, Welsh and N.Irish MPs who all have their own agendas. The electorate would regard it as a stitch-up deal to cling on to power by both the big losers and voters would wreak their revenge at the next election which would be quite soon and would result in a Tory landslide.

Yes I think it an affront to democracy.

It never occured to me the reason why he is quitting :0

He has sacrificed himself to try and keep Labour in power !

/>http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/election/article-1276579/Gordon-Brown-sacrifices-promises-quit-PM-ditch-bid-deal-Lib-Dems.html

The reasoning is that Clegg can't get on with Brown and wants his head.

Mr Brown's extraordinary announcement came after two cloak-and-dagger meetings with Mr Clegg, in which it seems he was told he had to go if there was to be any chance of a Lab-Lib deal.

Crikey, I've never been so engrossed in politics as there's so much happening :D

[CurlyWhirly]

Crikey, I've never been so engrossed in politics as there's so much happening :D

/>http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1276591/Alastair-Campbell-Sky-News-presenter-Adam-Boulton-come-blows-live-TV-bitter-row-Browns-legacy.html :D

[catgate]

Crikey, I've never been so engrossed in politics as there's so much happening :D

The one big thing that is not going on is consulting the electorate as to what they would like to see happen.

Instead they are fudging together "an alliance" to suit their own agendas and "sod the bloody electorate".

Power, powe,r power....and not one of them fit to handle it.

[rong]

And Curly believes what the Mail writes

[AlanHo]

Here is the John Reid statement. I think he makes a lot of sense.

Click here

[CurlyWhirly]

And Curly believes what the Mail writes

It's on the BBC website too

/>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8673750.stm

Why has Brown made this announcement now?

His hand appears to have effectively been forced by Liberal Democrat leader Nick Clegg, who did not want to begin substantive talks about the formation of a possible coalition government with Labour while Mr Brown was its leader, fearing he would be seen as propping up an unpopular prime minister who has been rejected by the majority of voters in Thursday's general election.

[Gandalph]

A Labour MP announced on the TV three day's ago that Brown would have to go as leader. This had been reflected by the Public Vote on May 6th that Brown was not popular with the people.

It's funny in a sense though. Labour picked up 41 of the 59 seats here in Scotland.

[CurlyWhirly]

A Labour MP announced on the TV three day's ago that Brown would have to go as leader. This had been reflected by the Public Vote on May 6th that Brown was not popular with the people.

Yes but he gets to stay on as PM until the autumn !

It's funny in a sense though. Labour picked up 41 of the 59 seats here in Scotland.

That's because Scotland is a Labour stronghold, Wales used to be but not so much now.

[AlanHo]

It's funny in a sense though. Labour picked up 41 of the 59 seats here in Scotland.

Labour's core vote lies in deprived areas where there is high unemployment or a dis-proportionate ratio between public and private employment, and growing dependency on state hand-outs. Some strong labour areas have ridiculously high levels of people claiming long term sickness benefits, disability allowances and other benefits which the conservatives will try to clean up. Greedy turkeys are not going to vote for Christmas so it has served labour well to increase dependency on state hand-outs and create thousands of unecessary public service jobs.

Perhaps there are large areas in Scotland where this applies.

[CurlyWhirly]

Labour's core vote lies in deprived areas where there is high unemployment or a dis-proportionate ratio between public and private employment, and growing dependency on state hand-outs. Some strong labour areas have ridiculously high levels of people claiming long term sickness benefits, disability allowances and other benefits which the conservatives will try to clean up.

So they should, I know some people who have never worked and get more in state benefits than I earn

There's nothing wrong with them either as they do odd jobs for cash.

[Gandalph]

It's funny in a sense though. Labour picked up 41 of the 59 seats here in Scotland.

Labour's core vote lies in deprived areas where there is high unemployment or a dis-proportionate ratio between public and private employment, and growing dependency on state hand-outs. Some strong labour areas have ridiculously high levels of people claiming long term sickness benefits, disability allowances and other benefits which the conservatives will try to clean up. Greedy turkeys are not going to vote for Christmas so it has served labour well to increase dependency on state hand-outs and create thousands of unecessary public service jobs.

Perhaps there are large areas in Scotland where this applies.

I'm sure there are Alan.

But I don't know whether they outnumber the places in England where the same thing is happening. There are about 5.5 million inhabitants in Scotland of which roughly 2 million are immigrants. The job level here is far less than what it is in England, obviously, because there is not the industry here to support it.

This has always been a shout at Salmond issue. He wants an Independent Scotland, home rule and all the rest of it. My shout with him has always been "How the hell can Scotland stand on it's own two feet financially". No employment = no income tax or national insurance so where the hell is he going to get the money from for Scotland to stand on it's own two feet. The simple answer here is 'it can't'.