catgate Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 I wasn't sure where to put this. It may have been better in the Jokes dept. On the other hand, if it is true, maybe WF should open up an emigration advice forum.http://www.mailonsunday.co.uk/pages/live/a...d=1770&ct=5Can I suggest andsome takes a couple of pills before reading it. (Oh,,, and sits down too) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanHo Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 If it was not for the profanities that just passed my lips - I would be speechless.It was a pleasure to be enjoying a beautiful sunny day - then you go and ruin it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andsome Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 The only redeeming thing about all that is that it is in the Mail on Sunday. Surely even this bunch of idiots would not be so daft as to issue such bonds, or would they? If this does turn out to be true, then possibly, just possibly, it will persuade those still blind enough to support this sorry apology of a government, to desert them at long last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-pops- Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Architect: former Treasury adviser Ed Balls, the Premier's most powerful Cabinet ally, devised the Islamic bonds proposalHow apt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dencandy Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 I don't see the problem. Nearly the whole of the Middle East and much of Asia runs on Islamic banking principles, and most of their banks are very profitable. This wouldn't require anyone to change UK laws as far as I can see, they're just a different set of regulations, that's all, just like the different regulations that govern (genuine) Building Societies and Friendly Societies, on the one hand, and High Street banks, on the other.The Mail on Sunday is just scare-mongering, as far as I can see. Calm down you lot, you wouldn't have to comply by those regulations, unless you choose to by buying these bonds. Just as you don't have to deposit savings in a Building Society, unless you choose to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catgate Posted February 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Ah! You haven't seen the wonderful opportunity this give the lame brained Prudence of taking Rials and giving them to China now, for us to pay for after the current UK national debt of £100,000 per household is cleared (if ever).UK Government Bails Out Less Indebted LiberiaGuido gets Treasury press releases, yesterday one caught his eye: UK helps Liberia take big step towards debt clearance The UK today assisted Liberia in taking a big step towards poverty reduction by helping it clear the arrears on debt it owes....Alistair Darling went on to boast about how great this was for Liberia, which he described as a "HIPC", a Heavily Indebted Poor Country. The 3 million inhabitants of Liberia have a government debt of $4.5 billion dollars, some £2.3 billion pounds or £767 per head.Yesterday the ONS added £52 billion to the PSBR for Northern Rock taking the government's admitted debts to 42% of GDP, busting Gordon's already fiddled 40% golden rule. Gordon claims government debts stand at £536 billion, add in his off balance sheet fiddles like £725 billion of public sector pensions, £110 billion in payments due to companies in the next three decades under PFI and £18 billion of debt held by Network Rail and the figure is nearer £1.4 trillion, which is well over 100% of GDP. Now add on the private debts of credit card maxed-out Britons and the total debt is something like £2.7 trillion. Over £100,000 per household in Britain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurlyWhirly Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 Ah! You haven't seen the wonderful opportunity this give the lame brained Prudence of taking Rials and giving them to China now, for us to pay for after the current UK national debt of £100,000 per household is cleared (if ever).UK Government Bails Out Less Indebted LiberiaGuido gets Treasury press releases, yesterday one caught his eye: UK helps Liberia take big step towards debt clearance The UK today assisted Liberia in taking a big step towards poverty reduction by helping it clear the arrears on debt it owes....Alistair Darling went on to boast about how great this was for Liberia, which he described as a "HIPC", a Heavily Indebted Poor Country. The 3 million inhabitants of Liberia have a government debt of $4.5 billion dollars, some £2.3 billion pounds or £767 per head.Agreed.This government loves to spend our taxpayers money on other countries and even bailing them out like in your example above.No wonder why the national debt is rising year in year out and it will eventually have to be repaid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catgate Posted February 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 No wonder why the national debt is rising year in year out and it will eventually have to be repaid.I wonder if that is what Gordon is saving up for, out of his undeclared office rent? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dencandy Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 No wonder why the national debt is rising year in year out and it will eventually have to be repaid.No it won't. It's been rising since the 17th century, all that has to be repaid is the interest. So long as the rate of increase in annual income on average exceeds the rate of increase in interest payments, it could go on rising for ever. But I agree, when we read about it continuously going up year after year, it sounds terrible. But in practice it's not as bad as it sounds.Also it's worth remembering that the only countries without national debts were the former communist ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catgate Posted February 17, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 No wonder why the national debt is rising year in year out and it will eventually have to be repaid.No it won't. It's been rising since the 17th century, all that has to be repaid is the interest. So long as the rate of increase in annual income on average exceeds the rate of increase in interest payments, it could go on rising for ever. But I agree, when we read about it continuously going up year after year, it sounds terrible. But in practice it's not as bad as it sounds.Also it's worth remembering that the only countries without national debts were the former communist ones. You are not an ex- treasury advisor are you? Or a non-dom?How can it be inconsequential to have a mounting debt to pass on to the next generation? How can anyone live with a clear conscience and debt.?I remember an old tale about a chap going into a temple and upskittling the tables of the money men? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CurlyWhirly Posted February 17, 2008 Report Share Posted February 17, 2008 No wonder why the national debt is rising year in year out and it will eventually have to be repaid.No it won't. It's been rising since the 17th century, all that has to be repaid is the interest. So long as the rate of increase in annual income on average exceeds the rate of increase in interest payments, it could go on rising for ever. But I agree, when we read about it continuously going up year after year, it sounds terrible. But in practice it's not as bad as it sounds.Crikey I didn't know that :0 Personally I wouldn't want that sort of system with my mortgage as the house would never be mine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dencandy Posted February 18, 2008 Report Share Posted February 18, 2008 Well, that's how the system works. Yes, it is a bit like a perpetual mortgage, but so long as Standard & Poor give a country a positive rating that means the money lenders are confident they can keep up the interest payments. And the UK does have a very positive rating.Also, note that if you have any sort of income from a private pension, a PEP, Friendly Society, etc much of that income will come from interest paid by the government on bonds they've purchased from various governments (and the sale of bonds is partly what a National Debt is).I wouldn't lose any sleep over Britain's National Debt, if I were you. Now if Robert Mugabe was to replace dear old Gordon as PM, that would be a different matter..."It ain't what people believe that's a problem. It's what people believe but ain't so that's the problem" - Mark Twain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dencandy Posted February 19, 2008 Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 There's a much more thoughtful view of the question of Sharia law and the world of finance from The Times Online here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catgate Posted February 19, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2008 The only way to avoid such debacles as Sub Primes, Northern Rock and what ever is in the resultant pipe line, is to make it illegal to lend more that is held on deposite. No one has mentioned that 10x is universal practice and even much higher figures are commonplace. Currently non-existant "notional" money is lent, and an interest in "real" money is charged on it. The real money is then the "backing" for the next x10 loan. No wonder there is not enough money to pay the ensuing debts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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