Good old Gordon.

[catgate]

Does it not make you proud to be Britsh.

http://news.monstersandcritics.com/uk/arti...tion_aid_pledge

We can now watch our hospitals and welfare services contracting, our pensioners struggling to find sufficient to pay fuel bills and council tax, and the Westminster trough constantly being refilled, with a warm glow in our hearts knowing that we have such a careing, sharing Chancellor.

I just wonder if his definition of "pledge" is the same as Tonies (ie breakable promise) or does he use it in the pawnbroker sense (ie we are going into hoc even further)

[Alan2273]

Why do we have to keep giving money to these third world countries, where the politicians are more corrupt than our own.

What is wrong with sorting the problems out in the UK and then if their is anything left making sure it gets used for what it was intended and that is not for lining the pockets of corrupt governments.

[Belatucadrus]

Not too sure I'd be thrilled to be offered an English education if I came from Mozambique. Potential prosecution by the CPS or the PC crew if you speak out of turn and at the end a crop of A grade A-levels that nobody believes in any more. Because simply being an illiterate ignoramus no longer qualifies you as a failure. It's a contentious term that could damage the fragile minds of today's kiddie winks.

[catgate]

I wonder at the suitability of this man to be in charge of anything. He is committing the people of this country to a 10 year period of donordom. He will be seeking election in that period. Does he think the country is inhabited by moronic simpletons? Maybe he has been "advised", by one of the legion of advisors swilling about in the corridors of power, that all will be forgotten, but which advisor has advised him to "pledge" in the first place?

It makes one wonder why we need the likes of Blair and Brown when their advisors are perfectly capable of fouling up the entire country on their own (and feathering their nests at the same time).

[r4may]

WE cannot afford to be this generous

[Tankus]

I REALLY dont understand this ....!

[CurlyWhirly]

Why do we have to keep giving money to these third world countries, where the politicians are more corrupt than our own.

What is wrong with sorting the problems out in the UK and then if their is anything left making sure it gets used for what it was intended and that is not for lining the pockets of corrupt governments.

Very well said Alan.

I agree 100% as IMHO charity begins at home.

[Belatucadrus]

I've a sneaky suspicion that Nelson Mandela massaging his enormous ego, may have helped him be so generous in his bid to buy himself a position as a statesman of world stature.

But what the hell why should be bother it isn't his money and by the time the bill turns up he doesn't plan on being chancellor, so he won't have to worry about it then.

[andsome]

I have nothing against helping those less well off than ourselves in principle. It is NO good however to give money direct to the governments of these countries. The leaders are even more corrupt than our. If anything is to be given it should be done on a personal basis to a charity of the donors choice. I definitely don't want my money being given to some pumped up politician who will secret it away in a Swiss bank account.

[catgate]

After pondering a little longer I would like to know:=

1 Who gave Brown the mandate to distribute money, taken from British taxpayers, to any overseas cause of his choseing?

2 Where, in the New Labour election manifesto, did it say that the duties of the PM and his cabinet colleagues would include spend much of their time trying to rule the rest of the world (utilising our taxes), instead of doing what they were elected to do?

3. What sort of a government is it that robs pension funds, wastes millions and millions of pounds on 'improving' the NHS into a state of penury, tells those that put it in power that they will have to work until they are at least 70, will have to pay for private health care and will also have to make provision for their own pensions (out of what is not forcibly removed from them by stealth taxes etc), so that this wonderfully caring government can go and cause a mess in other part of the world.

Answers on a postcard to

10/11 Downing Street

WC

[AlanHo]

I cannot find a postcard big enough

[andsome]

It would need a whole 80 GB hard drive.

[Thos]

Well, I was going to keep clear of political diatribes for a while but in the absence of any other comment with a word in favour of what Gordon Brown is trying to do, I feel I should attempt to show that not all of this forum's membership agree with the previous comments.

Whilst, I too, have no wish to see any dictator's pockets lined with my money, the present scheme is part of a wholly welcome initiative aiming for every child in the world to get a primary school place. There are plans in place to ensure that the money goes solely for this purpose.

We, in the UK, are part of the fifth richest country in the world and in spite of the comments here and elsewhere in this forum its citizens are well fed and prosperous compared with some parts of the world. We can and should be able to contribute to initiatives of this sort.

Nevertheless, I took great amusement from this cartoon:-

Thos.

[andsome]

A political debate on here just wouldn't be the same without you. :D :D :D :D

[catgate]

We, in the UK, are part of the fifth richest country in the world

Quotes such as this come up from time to time in various places and it usually is connected with the justification of giving money away. I have never seen any actual figures to support this view.

However, when it comes to spending money on projects in this country like NHS, pensions, Real improvement to education, more police etc. etc we can never afford them.

We can and should be able to contribute to initiatives of this sort.

We can and should be consulted, as electors, as to whether this should be done, and if so by how much.

[AlanHo]

I don't quite understand what being part of the fifth richest country in the World means - we are a country and not a part of one. I cannot believe that the average UK resident is 5th in a World league table of riches - not if you include the whole population here - both legal and illegals.

I don't often contribute to political postings but some recent ones have attracted my attention. I too feel that this government have exceeded their remit in giving away so much of our taxpayers money without the prior blessing of the electorate. Charity should begin at home. It is a matter of record that the countries with the richest resources (especially oil) are the bottom of the league when it comes to donating to the poorer nations. Only when we get our health and educational systems in order should we be indulging in such foreign aid.

[andsome]

I don't quite understand what being part of the fifth richest country in the World means - we are a country and not a part of one. I cannot believe that the average UK resident is 5th in a World league table of riches - not if you include the whole population here - both legal and illegals.

I don't often contribute to political postings but some recent ones have attracted my attention. I too feel that this government have exceeded their remit in giving away so much of our taxpayers money without the prior blessing of the electorate. Charity should begin at home. It is a matter of record that the countries with the richest resources (especially oil) are the bottom of the league when it comes to donating to the poorer nations. Only when we get our health and educational systems in order should we be indulging in such foreign aid.

EXACTLY. Charity is up to the individual donor.

[AlanHo]

I feel I am being slightly hypocritical in posting to this thread. For ages now I have sat on the touchline here watching the loony left, loony right, loony middle, loony liberals, loony fundamentalists, loony PC brigade and loony agnostics like myself have a go at each other in the forum as if it was of fundamental importance.

But it is not - no-one here by posting their opinions is likely to make a difference to the opinions or beliefs of others in the forum who have a defined mind set - let alone the governement in the larger scheme of things.

As individuals we may huff and puff all we like - but at the end of the day politicians will be politicians and carry on regardless. You can only hope that one day the ballot box will turn in your favour - but don't hold your breath.

Frustrating innit

[catgate]

You can only hope that one day the ballot box will turn in your favour - but don't hold your breath.

Frustrating innit

Sadly it never will. It will always turn in favour of the politicians. What is needed is for a large number of younger people, with the necessary energies and education, to take heed of we boring old farts. Then take hold firmly of the current electoral system and totally destroy it. They can then build in its place a system totally devoid of parties, 'isms' and 'ities'.

Unfortunately what is going on is "normal" to them.

[doug]

That sounds like a dictatorship to me. At least we only have a democratic dictatorship at present.

[catgate]

That sounds like a dictatorship to me. At least we only have a democratic dictatorship at present.

Yes it does. I've conveyed the wrong impression, totally, by not chosing my words carefully enough.

By

system totally devoid of parties, 'isms' and 'ities'.

I was trying to indicate a system that was not totally controlled by a group with vested interests. The use of parties, particularly when you get down to just a couple, is that government is more easily deflected from true democracy by unscroupulous leaders and their selfseeking supporters/backers.

It is a paradox that diversity, beit Bio, Ethnic or Sexual in never far away from the lips of our current incumbants. Yet when it comes to 'decision' there is no room what so ever for diversity of opinion or view. But were the Palace of Westminster full of free minded people, there would certainly be more time spent in debate, but less dogma and fewer holy cows, and more decisions based on reality and not pious (?) hope.

[andsome]

Another thing about it all in this country is the House of Lords. I was with B'liar 100% when he said he wanted to reform it. I was naive enough to believe that he meant GENUINE reform. It is ridiculous that a bunch of people can help make decisions that affect us all, just by virtue of an accident of birth. This was further compounded by Lordships etc bestowed upon those who had had their time in the commons. What did we get for the reform? An even worse, longer list of those sent there as a favour of the party leaders. If we are to have a two house system, it's about time the second house was also elected, as in other countries. This election could take place say two years after the commons election.

I take Alan's point about the fact that we on this forum cannot make any difference, but it doesn't half make you feel better to have your say.

[Thos]

I have never seen any actual figures to support this view.

We can and should be consulted, as electors, as to whether this should be done, and if so by how much.

There are various measurements, depending on what you want the figures to prove ( :) ) such as gross GDP, per capita GDP, purchasing power and so on, but it is a fact that the UK is part of G7, the bloc of the 7 richest countries in the world.

As to whether all citizens should be consulted, whether you like it or not those same citizens elected a Government to make these decisions. That is the system under which the country makes its collective mind up.

I don't quite understand what being part of the fifth richest country in the World means - we are a country and not a part of one.

Sorry, Alan, if my words are ambiguous. I meant that we as individuals, are part of the fifth richest country etc. As a whole, we are, of course, that country.

But isn't all this semantics. I believe that the UK should help those less fortunate than ourselves. It is an accident of birth that we live here, with all of the advantages we have. Those children the Chancellor wants to help on our behalf deserve schooling and, providing the money does not go to corrupt rulers, I think we should applaud the initiative.

To be honest, I feel quite disappointed that so many contributors to this topic, whose general contributions I respect, feel differently.

Thos.

[spikeychris]

Charity begins at home. I hate this phrase more than I hate any other. Which charities?

Acorns Children's Hospice Trust

Action Cancer

Action for Peoples in Conflict

Age Concern

Age Concern Lancashire

Age Concern Milton Keynes

Age Concern Northern Ireland

Age Concern Suffolk

Age Concern York

Alzheimer's Society

Animals in Distress

Ardgowan Hospice

Arthritis Research Campaign

Arthur Rank Hospice

ASBAH

Aston-Mansfield

Barnardo's

Barnsley (St Peter's) Hospice

Beacon Centre for the Blind

Bethany Christian Trust

Birmingham Settlement

Blythswood Trading

Brainwave

Break

British Heart Foundation

British Red Cross

Butterwick Hospice Retail

Cancer Research UK

Cancer Research Wales

Capability Scotland

Central & Cecil Housing Trust

Chest, Heart & Stroke Scotland

Childline Scotland

Children's Hospice Association Scotland

Children's Hospice South West

Claire House Shops Ltd.

CLIC

Compton Hospice

Cosgrove Care

Cotswold Care Hospice Shops

Devon Air Ambulance Trust

DebRA

Demelza House Trading Ltd.

Derian House Children's Hospice

Dogs Trust

Dorothy Kerin Trust (Burrswood)

Douglas Macmillan Hospice Shops

East Anglia Children's Hospices

Eden Valley Hospice

Ellenor Hospice

Enable Ireland

Essex Air Ambulance

Exeter Leukaemia Fund

FARA Foundation

Farleigh Hospice

Force Cancer Charity

give2give

Greenwich & Bexley Cottage Hospice

Guild Care

Hamelin House

Harpenden Mencap

Harris Hospiscare

Haven House Foundation

Headway - The Brain Injury Association

Helen House and Douglas House

Help The Aged

Home Farm Trust

Homeaid Caithness

Home-start Teesside

Hope House Children's Hospice

Hospice in the Weald

Hospice of St Francis

Hospiscare

Iain Rennie Hospice At Home

Katharine House Hospice, Banbury

Katharine House Hospice, Stafford

Kent Association for the Blind

Lindsey Lodge Hospice

Leonard Cheshire

Mare and Foal Sanctuary

Marie Curie Cancer Care

Martin House Children's Hospice

Martlets Hospice

Mary Stevens Hospice

Menphys

Mercy in Action

Minds Matter

Myton Hamlet Hospice

Naomi House Children's Hospice

National Association of Victim Support

National Animal Welfare Trust

National Kidney Research Fund

NCH

North Devon Hospice

Notting Hill Housing Trust

Nottinghamshire Hospice

Oxfam

Oxfam Northern Ireland

Pasque Hospice

Paul Bevan Cancer Foundation

Paul Sartori Foundation

PDSA

Peace Hospice Shops Ltd

Pilgrims Hospices in East Kent

Prospect Hospice

Queen Elizabeth's Foundation For Disabled People

Queenscourt Hospice

Relate Croydon

Richard House Children's Hospice

Roy Castle Retail Ltd.

RSPCA

Salvation Army Trading Company Ltd

Save the Children Fund

Scope

Sense

Sense Scotland

Shooting Star

Severn Hospice

Shakespeare Hospice

Shaw Trust Retail

Shelter Shops

Shooting Star

Simon Community Northern Ireland

Sobell House Hospice Charity

Spitalfields Crypt Trust

Springhill Hospice

St Andrew's Hospice

St Ann's Hospice

St Barnabas Hospice Shops

St Benedict's Hospice

St Catherine's Hospice

St Catherine's Hospice (Scarborough)

St Clare's Hospice

St David's Foundation

St Elizabeth Hospice

St Elizabeth's Centre

St Gemma's Hospice

St Giles Hospice

St Helena Hospice

St John's Hospice - the Hospice in the Heart of London

St John's Hospice and Cancer Care Shops

St John's Hospice In Wirral

St Joseph's Hospice Association

St Leonard's Hospice

St Luke's (Cheshire) Hospice

St Luke's Hospice

St Luke's Hospice, Basildon

St Luke's Hospice, Plymouth

St Luke's Kenton Grange Hospice (Harrow & Brent)

St Mary's Hospice

St Michael's Hospice

St Michael's Hospice, Hampshire

St Nicholas' Hospice

St Oswalds Hospice

St Peter & St James Hospice Shops

St Raphael's Hospice

St Richards Hospice

St Rocco's Hospice

St Teresa's Hospice

St Vincent de Paul Society, London

Sue Ryder Care

Tapping House Hospice

Teeside Hospice

Tenovus, The Cancer Charity

The Action Group

The Blue Cross

The Children's Society

The Children's Trust

The Extracare Charitable Trust

The Haven, Wolverhampton

The Martlets Hospice

The Mary Ann Evans Hospice

The Norman Laud Association

The Padley Group

The Princess Alice Hospice

The Shakespeare Hospice

The South Bucks Hospice

The Wayne Howard Trust

Thorne House Services For Autism

Traid

Treetops Hospice

Trinity Hospice

Wakefield Hospice

Wales Air Ambulance

Walsall Hospice Appeal

Watford & District Mencap

Watford New Hope Trust

West Cumbria Hospice at Home

Weston Hospicecare Mart

Wigan And Leigh Hospice

Willen Hospice

Woking Hospice

Woodlands Hospice Charitable Trust

Woodland Respite Care Centre

Yeldall Homeless Projects

YMCA England

young@now

Shall we wait until these (a very small proportion) have been fully funded before we consider helping starving children elsewhere? Now I know this latest venture is education but empowerment leads to self reliance that leads to understanding issues that leads to problem solving. PLEASE don’t say charity begins at home.

[catgate]

You missed out the most important one:-

Poor Children's Father's Beer Fund.